Tier 3 token imbalance

[Nukey]

Hey everyone,

I'd like to suggest a small quality-of-life adjustment to the current Tier 3 token distribution.

With all the great custom and optional Tier 3 sets available on the server, the demand per token has become heavily skewed between two of the groups:

Warrior / Rogue Token:

Warrior: 2 sets
Rogue: 1 set

Total: 3 sets



Druid / Shaman / Paladin / Hunter Token:

Druid: 3 sets
Shaman: 3 sets
Paladin: 3 sets
Hunter: 1 set

Total: 10 sets

Having 10 eligible sets competing for a single token while another token only covers 3 sets creates an unnecessary bottleneck for hybrid/hunter drops compared to warrior/rogue.

Proposal:
Move Paladin over to share tokens with Warrior and Rogue.

This balances the distribution much better:

Warrior / Rogue / Paladin: 6 sets

Druid / Shaman / Hunter: 7 sets

This would significantly smooth out token competition in Naxxramas, reduce wasted drops, and make gearing feel much fairer across all raid rosters.


A similar "setup" was also suggested by my friend Seffix on turtle, but it was never implemented.
We both played classes that fought for the same token in naxx. We spent over a good year to get all "our" tier pieces between us, because of the insane competition for the same items.

What do you guys think?

[Gralle]

**+1, fully behind this.**

The math speaks for itself, one token covering 10 sets vs. another covering only 3 is a real bottleneck, not a theoretical one. Moving Paladin to share with Warrior/Rogue (6 vs 7 sets) is a simple, low-effort fix that makes gearing noticeably fairer for hybrids/hunters in Naxx without touching anything drastic.

Hope this gets more traction than Seffix's version did on Turtle, seems like an easy win for raid rosters overall.

[Niyu]

you are still drunk on power.

you clearly only want warriors and paladins in raid.

there is nothing to fix here. aside from their greed.

[Miseraloe]

You are the one drunk Niyu

[Niyu]

You can't even argument on the smallest thing and it's probably your substance abuse that's the cause.

[Daevv2]

This is a very good suggestion. Sounds like a no-brainer.

[Kairion]

Turtlewows main reason never to address this was because at any point in time, someone might have a token in their inventory that might be unusable after such a change.

While Naxx is still years out, the token situation absolutely has to be resolved before naxx gets released. It is extremely frustrating for anyone involved. Warriors and Rogues will have their tokens thrown at them quicker than they can say stop, completely trivializing gearing and invalidating previous efforts. In warriors case, there is also a considerable amount of non set pieces available for gearing.

And as a result of getting done with gearing so quickly, they will branch out to play alts over running a raid that doesn't provide useful loot anymore

Meanwhile for Paladins, Shamans, Druids, and Hunters the set is so rare, players will need multiple months just for one set. For most of their specs almost no alternate gear to tiersets exists. Doubly funny considering these players might want an alternate tierset to be able to either assist their raid better when the raid is short one healer or tank, or in case of the more supporting specs, they might want an alternate version to use for farming or open world content.

Anyone who is against this has never had the "pleasure" to gear any of those 4 classes in Naxx content.

[Nukey]

Turtlewows main reason never to address this was because at any point in time, someone might have a token in their inventory that might be unusable after such a change.

While Naxx is still years out, the token situation absolutely has to be resolved before naxx gets released. It is extremely frustrating for anyone involved. Warriors and Rogues will have their tokens thrown at them quicker than they can say stop, completely trivializing gearing and invalidating previous efforts. In warriors case, there is also a considerable amount of non set pieces available for gearing.

And as a result of getting done with gearing so quickly, they will branch out to play alts over running a raid that doesn't provide useful loot anymore

Meanwhile for Paladins, Shamans, Druids, and Hunters the set is so rare, players will need multiple months just for one set. For most of their specs almost no alternate gear to tiersets exists. Doubly funny considering these players might want an alternate tierset to be able to either assist their raid better when the raid is short one healer or tank, or in case of the more supporting specs, they might want an alternate version to use for farming or open world content.

Anyone who is against this has never had the "pleasure" to gear any of those 4 classes in Naxx content.

Thats a beautiful way to put it, glad theres more players with the same feelings about this as I have.

I do hope they leave in the tokens tho, we just need a rebalance of who is assigned to which token.
And yes, naxx is far out, but this shouldnt be fixed "close" to naxx release, do it now, be prepared.
AQ40 luckily isnt this bad with its tokens.

[Defiant]

Proposal:
Move Paladin over to share tokens with Warrior and Rogue.

This balances the distribution much better:

Warrior / Rogue / Paladin: 6 sets

Druid / Shaman / Hunter: 7 sets

This would significantly smooth out token competition in Naxxramas, reduce wasted drops, and make gearing feel much fairer across all raid rosters.

I fully support this. To anyone wanting to say oh this is how it's always been-- No. I fully disagree. First of all you didn't have Shamans / Paladins in the same groups, but beyond that they also didn't have as meaningful alternate specs.

The changes that Turtle made, which I fucking adore to be clear, did create imbalance with the T3 tokens. I always felt this should be addressed on Turtle and was disappointed it never got changed.

Here's a consideration I don't often see people talk about but it's a real factor. On Turtle we had our Rogues gear up extremely fast. They were the first to get their sets completed. We also ended up losing a few of those geared up Rogues because we weren't ready to step into K40 yet, and they got everything they needed out of Naxx *extremely fast*. Then when they have no real reason to show up to Naxx, they lose motivation or interest. This wasn't the case with *all* of our Rogues / Warriors but as a guild leader it's something I did notice. Six months after our first Rogue left fully geared I as a Resto Shaman still didn't have a full set. Tbh I don't care so much, I'm 100% about the journey not the destrination, and to an extent that's RNG, my bad luck on rolls, etc etc-- but also not really because all of our Rogues / Warriors were getting kitted out extremely fast.

So there's three distinct factors at work there, first of all Shamans/Paladins/Druids/Hunters who have bad luck and are on a Token that's extremely contested start to lose hope that they'll ever even get their upgrades, which is a bad feeling if RNG is against you. Then you have the Rogues / Warriors gearing up extremely fast and *potentially* losing interest in showing up. The third factor is the combination of those two things, with the Shaman/Paladins/Druids/Hunters frustrated but also watching the Rogues/Warriors gear up extremely easily and that compounds their frustration and annoyance and also compounds the Rogues / Warriors losing interest because if they look at the raid and think damn I'm already K40 ready and these guys need probably months more Naxx runs and they just go find a guild ready for K40.

I'm just giving my two cents as a guild leader because managing peoples frustrations and expectations in my eyes was a relatively large role as a leader and in the conversations I did see about token imbalance I never saw people sharing this perspective.