Gameplay advantages from donation shop

[Hkl]

The fact that you can buy a 36 slot bag for donations is unacceptable. The same goes for the remote mail terminal, the same goes for the field repair bot and summonable auctioneer, mobile bank etc. Not only is this blatantly spending money for in game advantages (where else can you get these things i wonder). With this, i can have herbalism and alchemy, with one of the perks of the engineering profession; field repair bot.
But the most egregious are the auctioneer and mailbox, these things being limited in geography is a big part of why the world and big cities feel alive in WoW.
The cosmetic stuff is fine as is, having this pay to win garbage is terrible for the ethicacy of the project and not even blizzard does anything like this in retail.

[Lieonme1]

I guess I don't understand how someone with these items is better than you in the game?
Personally, bag space management is one thing i don't like about WoW, so the ability to get 36slot bags makes the game more fun for me. It doesn't impact you, it just makes me enjoy my time in Azeroth more.

Some people have a pet peeve about mail, or AH, or repair, or bank. Whatever it may be, the only advantage it gives people is the ability to stay out in the world, doing what they enjoy doing.

Could you explain how my 36 slot bag lets me win over you?

[Darnok2701]

Personally I too think the rant is overblown.

However both of you explain how the mechanics are "pay to win" and "ruin the experience".

Making the game more enjoyable or less tedious sounds like a great definition for "winning". So being able to pay to make the game less tedious is kind of "pay to win".

The other point is that op describes returning to the capitals for banking and trade (or at least return to a postbox for some quick mail) as a core part of the experience of playing wow, making the cities feel more lived-in. I think this makes sense, since I heard people appreciate this about classic and twow added fast rested exp as another reason to frequent these points of community.

While I think the complaint is overblown, since only a few people she'll out the cash for these things and the world is lively regardless of them, I think dismissing OPs complaint feels disingenuous.

All in all I don't think the Devs will cut these items and I don't think they matter too much so...

[Dzielkus]

This kind of donation rewards we have on Octo lived with Turtle quite long time.

Portable bank/vendor/mail is rather quality of play enhacement than pay to win.
After all you're not buying any sulfuron ignots from donation tab
Aren't you?

And c'mon it's "free" game, we are all making some money, or at least we should - to donate "some" btc from time to time.
And this is obviously encouragement to do so.

[Zvyrhol]

Yes, these items give advantage. And to prove it, there must be at least 1 example.

It's also important what you consider P2W. Because if your ultimate endgame goal is to be the guy who farms the biggest amount of gold per hour, then without mobile vendor or auctioneer, it's impossible to be competetive.

36 slot bags were required if you were sweat raider. That's because some sets are exceptionally good in some specific fights.

Also, Turtle WoW (deliberately or not) allowed some faction-change bugs to exist. You could do more quests than intended to earn title. One title wasn't even obtainable for Horde because Horde didn't have access to that many quests. Some faction unique mounts and transmogs were inherited after race change. My friend had Frostwolf mount (AV one) as Alliance Paladin (I don't even know how it was possible lol).
You could use 2 banners in BGs, that was fixed however.

BTW, it's a shame new leadership didn't abolish these P2W elements.

[Defiant]

I hate to say it like this, but you should go play on Warmane so you understand what the term 'Pay to Win' actually means. I hate being dismissive like this but the argument is so tiring.

First of all the monetization is exactly the same as it was on Twow, which was a very popular server. So its clearly not a big issue.

Secondly there are so many private servers that have significantly worse monetization. Ascension was hyper monetized to a massive degree. Warmane you can outright buy legendaries and even full accounts on their website.

And hey, you are always welcome to host your own utopian server with zero monetization. These projects are not free to operate. They need to be able to pay for themselves. I feel that Turtle and by extension Octo does a very good job at offering enough that it should support the project financially without going overboard on the greed factor. Its a fine line to walk, and for me quality of life additions are entirely acceptable. I understand other people have different standards but Octo has less monetization than what Blizzard offers so I have a hard time taking the criticism seriously.

[Hkl]

Having monetization is fine, i'm not stupid. Supporting the projects through cosmetics is very good imo.
You ask how it impacts me? First of all, the rare bags from vanilla like ony bag lose their luster. They're no longer the best bags in the game.
Instead, the best bag is paid for with $.
Some people don't enjoy farming gold or leveling.
They think it's inconvenient. Is it QoL if they spend money to get this?
As i said, the bags are bad, mobile AH worse.
And yes, Warmane is worse, grats. I don't play thrre and i never would.
If you want to compare to another turtle competitor, Blizzard, doesn't have the gall to do this. They do cosmetics only.
I understand they need money; that's what cosmetics are for.
If you want to be a competative raider, bagspace is crucial. Not buying bags will make you less effective.

[Denin]

I mean it's a fair point of view, the fact that it's a form of pay to win is undeniable.

But i also don't think it's really not that big a deal.

Personally i like the practicality of most of these things.

The raid dropped and reputation bags are still very useful unless you go all in and fill your slots and bank all the way with shop bags. Something that would cost quite a bit of money, parts of that money hopefully goes towards improving the server and keeping it running.

And all the QoL part from the bags can mostly be shared in a grp or raid situation, it's a timer saver. But not like anyone needs any of it to play the game.

It's also possible to farm points without paying a single bitcoin. Utilizing slow and steady characters, as points are account based. This would take time and effort sure, but is a free option anyone can utilize if they want to.

It's fine not to like it but i think there is little chance of it changing. I don't know what the devs view on this is, but i can imagine how profitable the shop probably is, even with bitcoin only. If the devs want to build Octo further on top of what Turtle already made. It will require money. People rarely work for free over time, and server upkeep is a thing too.

[Shway]

I hate to say it like this, but you should go play on Warmane so you understand what the term 'Pay to Win' actually means. I hate being dismissive like this but the argument is so tiring.

First of all the monetization is exactly the same as it was on Twow, which was a very popular server. So its clearly not a big issue.

Secondly there are so many private servers that have significantly worse monetization. Ascension was hyper monetized to a massive degree. Warmane you can outright buy legendaries and even full accounts on their website.

And hey, you are always welcome to host your own utopian server with zero monetization. These projects are not free to operate. They need to be able to pay for themselves. I feel that Turtle and by extension Octo does a very good job at offering enough that it should support the project financially without going overboard on the greed factor. Its a fine line to walk, and for me quality of life additions are entirely acceptable. I understand other people have different standards but Octo has less monetization than what Blizzard offers so I have a hard time taking the criticism seriously.

Yes, it was exactly like it was on TWoW, except for the fact that you now use crypto for payment. There was a lot of RMT going on in TWoW believe it or not. I knew plenty of people that were buying gold, selling items and services for money. Hell, it seemed so many people were doing it, that I even broke down and bought gold myself because I knew of dozens of players doing it.

True, Ascension and Warmane do seem to have a more monetized "pay to win" scheme.
I also love the strawman argument of hey why don't you just set up a private server and make it yourself claim. Golden!

When it comes to server first with some kind of title and such (much like what was going on in Ambershire TWoW server), having 36 slot bags, AH vendor, Mailbox, Repair bot seem to be a bit broken in the spirit of giving that player such a title.

Even the hardcore on this server transfer over when they die and truly aren't even hardcore, it's sad.

Regardless, everyone has their own interpretation of "pay2win".

[Sagabal]

They are absolutely pay2win and become near-mandatory if you plan on doing any of the high level raid content considering the amount of consumes and alternate gear sets. The buff to vanilla bagslots helped, but the real sin is that aside from brainwasher and a worse version of the vendorbot, there is no in-game way to obtain any of these items legitimately without using the cash shop. Adding alternate obtainment methods, or ways of getting less versions of them like the vendorbot, would alleviate this a lot.