PvP/PVE gear balance

[Brwcht]

How is it that PvE players on a PvP server are better equipped than PvP players who only sit in BGs and look like idiots, because it would be easier for them to go on a raid? Why does reputation with PvE factions on a PvP server build up lightning‑fast, while reputation with PvP factions doesn’t even reach “Revered” after rank 10? The items that can be obtained at “exalted” are no better than what is currently available in raids. There are no rewards for raising rank. PvP sets have terrible PvP armor bonuses that are equal to the armor on PvE sets. Each piece in a slot can be obtained from a single source. For honor points, there are terrible trinkets and a neck (for casters). All of this is in a single instance, and there is no choice.
Suggestion: do at least something for PvP that doesn’t look like the turtlewow-style.

[Therealvda]

The more I look into it the more it looks like Turtle was made for PvE Andies ( crazy bad PvE changes that ruin PvP, like what they did to Feral or Paladin ) and they spared very little thought to PvP.

There's a reason their PvP server was peaking at only a few thousand.

[Dzielkus]

PvP realm is about having two separate factions, not to play only PvP.

You should thank 1.18 that we have pvp items at all.

And those blue sets are really strong for melee/tanks - good enough for t1 farm skiping all dungs.

[Fraz]

Honestly, AB gear is very good; and, for this tier, WSG reputation gear is actually very strong.

However, I am an advocate for buffing WSG rewards: Like OP has mentioned, it takes far to long to achieve exalted, I know in the past (before the ranking rework) players would achieve rank 14 whilst still being short of AB and WSG exalted reputation. On the other hand, AV rep is very quick and the rewards are fitting for T1; Bloodring reputation gain is at a sweet spot; and, the rewards are great, turtle did a good job with this one: however, they are not in the game yet. AB reputation is also well done, the Shoulders and Cape are considered by many to be PvP BiS, whilst the long grind it takes to get there accounts for this.

WSG reputation on the other hand takes far to long to for what it's worth: the revered rewards are perhaps ok for twinks of certains brackets, but, for a level 60, any given weapon drop from a level 60 dungeon will completely negate their existence. The revered rewards need buffs: the time investment needed to reach revered is by no means compensated by the reward. The exalted rewards are comparable to T2 raid gear in terms of stat density: however, their lack of set piece effects makes them nothing more than filler pieces. I can't see why anyone with R13 PvP gear would chose to equip any of these pieces outside of some niche build type.

Releasing Bloodring would honestly be a welcome remedy, as well as, revisiting the current PvP ranking gear available: I'm not sure if anyone else has brought this up, but, the current rogue rank gear is laughable. There is not a single line of hit rating on any of the gear; meaning, that rogues either have to take 5/5 in precision (which outright kills cold blood + hemo, noxious + blackjack and the sub daggers build) or look to PvE gear to achieve the needed 5% hit rating for PvP.

WSG reputation gear is what it is, if it remains the way it is, perhaps some players can achieve exalted before BWL comes out and the R10 restriction is removed: If so, they will have some good gear appropriate for the current power level of the server: However, the likelihood of that happening is very low and most players will not achieve this until quite some time after BWL has released, making the gear all but worthless to them.

My suggestion is: Either add a 2 piece set effect to the exalted WSG gear, that rewards: +X stamina, and, +X resilience; This would likely make these pieces PvP BiS for T2 and T2.5; or, (the better option) do as previously mentioned with the 2 piece set effect and give both the legs and bracers the 3% resilience treatment that the AB rewards have received, thus, making these endgame PvP BiS comparable to T3 and T3.5 gear. However, I do not agree with as much resilience as there currently is being in the game, as, it promotes a tank meta and draws out PvP combat by extending time to kill.

Edits: punctuation

[Berdal]

PvP realm is about having two separate factions, not to play only PvP.

You should thank 1.18 that we have pvp items at all.

Based.

[Zeniet]

How is it that PvE players on a PvP server are better equipped than PvP players who only sit in BGs and look like idiots, because it would be easier for them to go on a raid? Why does reputation with PvE factions on a PvP server build up lightning‑fast, while reputation with PvP factions doesn’t even reach “Revered” after rank 10? The items that can be obtained at “exalted” are no better than what is currently available in raids. There are no rewards for raising rank. PvP sets have terrible PvP armor bonuses that are equal to the armor on PvE sets. Each piece in a slot can be obtained from a single source. For honor points, there are terrible trinkets and a neck (for casters). All of this is in a single instance, and there is no choice.
Suggestion: do at least something for PvP that doesn’t look like the turtlewow-style.

Well, because this is vanilla wow and just how it is? sure there are lots of changes made to this server, but this doesn't really seem like an important addition. Go raid to get better gear, it's how it's always been done on vanilla servers.

[Brwcht]

PvP realm is about having two separate factions, not to play only PvP.

You should thank 1.18 that we have pvp items at all.

And those blue sets are really strong for melee/tanks - good enough for t1 farm skiping all dungs.

I think I'll thank you. I'll call you pvp Director No. 2 because you're just as useful as from No. 1. Your team has done a good job, it is not known what Director No. 1 has done for pvp... but you have done a lot, given a lot of useless advice and a lot of messages have been sent to the forum.

[Brwcht]

How is it that PvE players on a PvP server are better equipped than PvP players who only sit in BGs and look like idiots, because it would be easier for them to go on a raid? Why does reputation with PvE factions on a PvP server build up lightning‑fast, while reputation with PvP factions doesn’t even reach “Revered” after rank 10? The items that can be obtained at “exalted” are no better than what is currently available in raids. There are no rewards for raising rank. PvP sets have terrible PvP armor bonuses that are equal to the armor on PvE sets. Each piece in a slot can be obtained from a single source. For honor points, there are terrible trinkets and a neck (for casters). All of this is in a single instance, and there is no choice.
Suggestion: do at least something for PvP that doesn’t look like the turtlewow-style.

Well, because this is vanilla wow and just how it is? sure there are lots of changes made to this server, but this doesn't really seem like an important addition. Go raid to get better gear, it's how it's always been done on vanilla servers.

You will be known as the director of PvP No. 3. Thank you for telling me where to go. Would you be so kind as to give me at least one example where it’s the same on Octowow as it is on Vanilla? The same PvP sets, the same loot in the MK, the same -20 % damage in PvP, the same assassination, affliction, and arcane talents?

[Crackadia]

The argument that it would trivialize pve content is nonsense (good weapons dont clear raids by themselves). And bottom line you can always stagger pvp items by 1 week after a phase to allow for the server first race.

Being behind pve players in pvp-useful gear by a whole phase is ridiculous.

[Crackadia]

How is it that PvE players on a PvP server are better equipped than PvP players who only sit in BGs and look like idiots, because it would be easier for them to go on a raid? Why does reputation with PvE factions on a PvP server build up lightning‑fast, while reputation with PvP factions doesn’t even reach “Revered” after rank 10? The items that can be obtained at “exalted” are no better than what is currently available in raids. There are no rewards for raising rank. PvP sets have terrible PvP armor bonuses that are equal to the armor on PvE sets. Each piece in a slot can be obtained from a single source. For honor points, there are terrible trinkets and a neck (for casters). All of this is in a single instance, and there is no choice.
Suggestion: do at least something for PvP that doesn’t look like the turtlewow-style.

Well, because this is vanilla wow and just how it is? sure there are lots of changes made to this server, but this doesn't really seem like an important addition. Go raid to get better gear, it's how it's always been done on vanilla servers.

This isn't vanilla wow. In vanilla pvp gear was better than its counterpart for the phase (bwl) and was worth getting for pve.

On octo the pvp gear is gated in such a way that it will be useless forever. Its 1 phase behind and the tier items will be stronger.

This change makes the entire experience worse. For PvE players nothing changes (since you wouldnt have farmed the pvp items anyway). For PvP players this change is absolute shit. For players that do both and push, playing PvP makes no sense anymore.
No upgrades will come from PvP gear because it comes 1 phase late.

Its literally lose lose lose