PvP Ganking. Resurrection at the Graveyard

[Lomonosov]

Player kills that do not award Honor Points (or kills by a player who is 6 or more levels higher) should not be permanent, so that killed players can resurrect at the graveyard.

Goal: to counter griefers, of whom there are literally only a handful on the entire server (their characters include Matthew, Dagger, Ilililili, and a few others) who abuse the War Mode challenge.

What the griefers do:
They usually park their main character near a flight master, log off, and stay nearby on a low-level character from the opposing faction with the ShaguScan addon. When the addon detects a player in PvP mode, they log back in on their main character and kill that player in a single hit. This is a guaranteed death. There is no way to detect them using /who, nor is there any way to fight back or escape.

Possible objection:
Some may argue that if you enable War Mode, you are accepting the possibility of being killed. Yes, I am willing to die — but in a real battle. That is what the Battlelord title is supposed to represent. Being killed in one hit by a ganker who is waiting for you while effectively offline is not a battle. At this point, the title should be called Hide-and-Seek Lord, not Battlelord.

[Berdal]

I'd say; resurrect yourself on HC realm: never.

Instead prevent them from being able to engage PvP with grey levels unless they themselves are War Mode (or the other way around, they get a debuff preventing then from disabling PvP for 24hrs ingame time).

[Matt]

Just because someone dies in PVP, that doesn't automatically make them me. To my knowledge, there are 4 separate people who kill war mode players.

I hardly ever kill anyone at a flightmaster, I don't think the other hunters kill people at flightmasters often either. I travel across multiple zones and often use eagle eye to scout. A lot of the kills I get are because people whisper me and tell me if they see a war mode player. I level all of my characters in war mode.

Also, it is against the rules to play two characters in the same zone outside of city, but it's definitely a nice assumption. Glad you seem to have it all figured out.

[Lomonosov]

Debuffs for killing low-level players have already been discussed. I think that would be a bad solution, because under certain circumstances it would allow low-level characters to abuse high-level players.

If we instead introduce resurrection after being killed by a high-level player, it would make all real PvP deaths feel much more like a Mak’gora. I think that could actually be a really interesting experience.

Yes, with the ShaguScan addon, your pet basically becomes a homing torpedo. You simply click the player's name in the addon window and send your pet to attack. You don't even have to see the player yourself, either visually or through Eagle Eye. For players who don't know about ShaguScan, this can look almost like cheating, because there is no other way you could have detected them.

Ilililili usually camps the flight master in Sepulcher. If he were actually traveling around the zone looking for victims, they could also spot him through ShaguScan and simply log off. However, when he waits for a victim near the flight master, that strategy doesn't work. There is no honor in this. It's simply griefing with no way for the victim to defend themselves.

[Matt]

....that's one of the main benefits of being a rogue, being able to stealth around without addons like Spy or ShaguScan picking you up. It doesn't matter if it's "honorable" or not, that's just how the game has always worked.

War Mode on the hardcore server is already so easy in comparison to the normal realm, you can just ask around for gankers names and add them all to your friends list. At that point it becomes a game of either logging out or changing zones when a ganker comes online and is in the same zone as you. From a hunter perspective, it's almost impossible to hunt a specific war mode player down if they have you added to the friends list.

[Berdal]

Debuffs for killing low-level players have already been discussed. I think that would be a bad solution, because under certain circumstances it would allow low-level characters to abuse high-level players.

Loool, that's exactly what's happening now the other way around this is just a countermeasure to balance it out.

[Lomonosov]

These so-called “hunters” don't actually run around the zones looking for players. They simply camp low-level players in “safe” areas near quest hubs and flight masters. And if they do it the way I described, while being offline, neither /who scanning nor adding them to your friends list will help protect you from the ganker.

Your claim that War Mode on the Hardcore server is “much easier compared to the normal realm” is simply laughable. On the normal server, a player doesn't have to start over from level 1 after being ganked by a high-level player.

My proposal to allow resurrection after being killed by a high-level player would make War Mode on Hardcore much more playable and interesting, because all genuine deaths would feel much more like Mak’gora battles.

And why are you suddenly so worried about it? You'll still be able to get your “enjoyment” from killing low-level players even more often after they resurrect at the graveyard. So everyone wins by accepting this proposal.

Besides, the 20% bonus XP for War Mode players is by no means free. There is a cost, ranging from the time lost by having to resurrect at the graveyard after being ganked by a high-level player, as happens on the normal server, all the way to a complete death and having to start over from level 1 when killed by a player of a comparable level.

[Knifewrench]

These so-called “hunters” don't actually run around the zones looking for players. They simply camp low-level players in “safe” areas near quest hubs and flight masters. And if they do it the way I described, while being offline, neither /who scanning nor adding them to your friends list will help protect you from the ganker.

Your claim that War Mode on the Hardcore server is “much easier compared to the normal realm” is simply laughable. On the normal server, a player doesn't have to start over from level 1 after being ganked by a high-level player.

My proposal to allow resurrection after being killed by a high-level player would make War Mode on Hardcore much more playable and interesting, because all genuine deaths would feel much more like Mak’gora battles.

And why are you suddenly so worried about it? You'll still be able to get your “enjoyment” from killing low-level players even more often after they resurrect at the graveyard. So everyone wins by accepting this proposal.

Besides, the 20% bonus XP for War Mode players is by no means free. There is a cost, ranging from the time lost by having to resurrect at the graveyard after being ganked by a high-level player, as happens on the normal server, all the way to a complete death and having to start over from level 1 when killed by a player of a comparable level.

Whats the difference between a high lvl rogue yeeting someone vs 2 rogues of same lvl or 1rogue waiting for a unfair fight?
Just dont warmode if u only want fair fights.

[Lomonosov]

The goal of my proposal is to counter the handful of griefers on the server who camp low-level War Mode players near quest hubs and flight masters. As you can see, your example is completely different from the situation I am proposing to address.

[Erc456]

i agree that something has to be done here. even non war moders just grief you. i took down a 32rogue when i was lvl 30 that i hunted down deep in enemy territory. 2days later i hit 31 and get griefed by a non war mode paladin lvl60 while the guy that i killed whispers f*** u from his new char ... i mean come on that's anticlimactic af way to go.. meanwhile the lvl60 faces 0 repercussions for griefing and is pvp unflagged in no time so it's not like sb can hunt him down either

I was hoping to go down fighting eventually facing justice for the crimes i commited. instead i get a 5s perma stun and a single ability thrown at me. that's just boring

I'm not even sure if i want a revive feature like the first guy suggested. But at least make non war moders that go into pvp permanently flagged so they can face justice for their crimes one day

might as well point the griefer out by name: Tallchad <hell fire>

come to think of it my proposal is make griefing a banable offense & and any player with pvp kills can no longer deflag himself so he is a permanent target. ain't no point in allowing 60s to prey on ppl 20-50lvls below them. also no point in allowing people to get away with murder - make them weigh the consequences of their own actions. otherwise u just kill actual hc pvp in its infancy on this server and promote griefing as a 0 consequence activity

don't wanna be all salty though: was an awesome journey. i got mail from jaina proudmoure (as horde??) with the pvp necklace city protector (15stamina n free teleport) for achieving most honorable kills of my race in that given week (1) huge flavor! i was a bit disappointed to hear that the bounty board in Stormwind that is outlined on octowow's pvp rewards page apparantly didnt exist nor offer a quest to kill me (as it should!) i think if you adress griefing and the 0 consequences more ppl would pvp and then u don't just need a single honorable kill to get city protector status.